And I added as a reason - the difficulty I was having with the amount of time it was taking to respond to your comments, your analysis of me that made - me - more the topic of conversation than the subject being discussed. Still any article or post or thread that criticizes GMO is a good thing to me, because it gets the word out. I expect the same good faith from you.. You accused me of labeling you. A movie (or someone else) comes up with some terrible conspiracy theory sort of plot. Molanic, I just finished reading that article in Mother Earth News. There has been more proven environmental damage caused by planting invasives, over-use of fertilizers, and habitat destruction then GMOs. Apr 27, 2014 - Monsanto owned seed brands OWNED BY MONSANTO OR SEMINIS OR SELL SMALL PERCENTAGES OF SEEDS FROM THEM. And with their history of trying to influence legislation, at some point, once they have a monopoly of owning seed companies, then what? Once of the great things about capitalism is that we can vote with our buying patterns. First, you have fused two subjects together based on the fact that one uses the technology. The 'foodandwaterwatch' link doesn't work, but it is two years old. And you are free to say whatever you want, but I have an opinion of what you had to say and have honestly shared it with you, as much for your benefit as for anything else. I'm going through them all :-). Jiffy created another industry breakthrough with the Jiffy pellet. Pupilla - Im surprised, that you have taken offense at my last post. To blame it all on GE crops is not an accurate portrayal of reality. And I don't think Monsanto will own these forever, the way they go, not very long at all since it is such an insignificant business to them. That was not the complete information I was looking for. Green Garden Products does not imply any affiliation with or endorsement from The Walt Disney Company. Is Ferry-Morse seeds owned by Monsanto? I will continue to grow my varieties no matter who makes them since any home garden variety I can buy is GMO-free so it is a no-brainer since I like the variety I should stick up for it because tomato seeds don't have a voice in this mess and they will be lost forever, and anyone boycotting home garden seeds that Monsanto bought will only contribute to the loss of these varieties since Monsanto is only a friend of its shareholders and with the stroke of a pen will stop producting these varieties and make them lost forever. I have Better Boy and Early Girl tomatoes in my garden, Monsanto varieties, and others in tomatoes really like Big Beef, another one of theirs all for the home garden market. I haven't bought a herbicide or insecticide. I dont see why gardeners cant support small companies who are not trying to compete with high tech seed companies. This means that a home gardener could unknowingly be supporting the development and proliferation of genetically modified crops if the seeds used are from Seminis. We all want this, right? McKenzie Seeds is a seed packaging company founded in Brandon, Manitoba in 1896. 0000519553 00000 n If you want to avoid the improved non-GMO varieties, just buy vintage varieties. $1.96. Companies are bought and sold every day in the seed business, and the corporate owners usually have nothing to do with the good people working at them who are hard working employees, many who like gardening and natural living, like me. If there are other companies that I should be concerned about, I'd like to know that too and respond the same way to their products. Do you see yourself as above the fray? Boycotting Better Boy by others, as an example, hurts me, not Monsanto. Once that I buy only conventionally bred seeds, and prefer only conventionally bred vegetables and fruits and GMOs concern me but this is a case by case problem. In 1981, the Ferry-Morse Seed Company was acquired by France's Groupe Limagrain. Then I illustrated it by showing you that the Florida Citrus Greening disease is here right here and now. You suggested that you respected this by saying afterwards: "I agree with you, it is an emotional issue, so sticking to facts and trying to say no less and no more than what you mean is important, just not always easy to do. Second, you dont have any way of knowing, why Monsanto is buying up so many seed companies. But Monsanto and Bayer had a history back to the 1950s, in a joint venture called Mobay . The Ferry-Morse Seed Company is a supplier of seeds, and was at one time the largest such company in the world. Dr. Thomson was forever proud of his Worlds Fair Gold Medal in Science and Industry awarded to SUPERthrive in 1940. As it is, many people are already avoiding corn and soy products in the supermarket because it is difficult to find any that are not genetically modified. Anyone have any information about that?". I do own my words and own my entire prior post, and your reply re-enforces that we are very far from each others' interpretation of events around us. I wasn't so much saying you were scare mongering as the article. It goes against my core beliefs. If you can tell their ideology from the title, it probably isn't. This is just disrespectful. Then I read: "Johnnys Seeds, Burpee Seeds, Territorial Seeds and Park Seeds Have Been Removed From This List, They Are Not Owned By Monsanto in Any way; These Companies Do Sell Great Quality Products In Whole." At this point in time, I do not have the time and did so reluctantly because I felt obligated to respond to your 2015 post addressed directly to me. And you are right, we're probably not putting a dent in their bottom line. As consumers, we have to bear the brunt of the responsibility for that. Go back and look at the first three comments made in 2015. You will find it is considered baloney by reliable fact-checkers that published a peer reviewed study which concluded the the rate of suicide has no correlation with the cited GMOs in India. When I entered this thread, it was a year ago, when I had the time to participate fully in a discussion. Any conversation, on any subject, even the weather, someone can participate in that conversation in a way that creates an unwillingness on the part of the other person to continue the conversation. They are reliable, trustworthy seeds you know will sprout and grow when you want them to. If others want to do this I am sympathetic but have mixed feelings about the effect of that. Do you realize that many people already are avoiding all soy and corn because of the difficulty now of finding non GMO soy and corn? Do you think the "Natural" or "Original" Species of plants ( and maybe other organisms too ) will go extinct because of the GMOs overpopulating the Whole World? And that has not changed since the first time I posted it. And I'm transferring the burden of 'fact checking' to others? False is false. Two posters before you objected to how riddled with false information the linked article that forms the basis of this thread is. You wrote: "Regardless of whether or not only commercial seeds are GMO, a statement by the company that sells seed to home gardeners, that they don't sell GMO seeds, helps eliminate confusion.". $1.44. I would have liked to have had a friendly, collaborative discussion, but unfortunately, that is not how this conversation has evolved. . I provided eight links and you ignored seven. My main objection to the combination of "GMO AND Monsanto" debate as you have presented is two-fold. What people seem to neglect in the conversation, is there is another side to the issue of genetic engineering.First, some things I will agree on: The overuse of herbicides and pesticides in agriculture and the GE of crops to resist the harmful side effects is cause for concern. Find My Store. Youre concerned with a few tomato varieties but yet, you cant seem to grasp the concern opponents of GMO seeds have about the potential loss of ALL unadulterated seed that supplies the worlds food suppy? And your end of the conversation is without flaws? And I prefer US grown produce always. Not relevant enough. Didn't know someone was trying to track the government officials who are making policy that allows Monsanto to continue along. Ive asked you a few questions which you have ignored. That is difficult to do when my friends are talking about, and I quote you describing a "documentary": "How about the film it links to, called Bitter Seeds which is a documentary about the impact of genetically modified cotton on Indias farmers and the suicide rate of over a quarter million Bt Cotton farmers each year due to financial stress resulting from massive crop failure and the price of Monsantos Bt seeds? 0000001926 00000 n But, I think I've spent enough time responding to this thread. Any questions I've asked were rhetorical and require no response. 2. a discussion involving differing points of view; debate: And no, I did not expect you to read all the links and report back on them to the thread. I carefully put a disclaimer transferring the burden of fact checking to others? Our favorite bit of history is that SUPERthrive was used in Disneyland Parks opening in 1955 to keep the new landscaping alive in the 100 degree summer weather. I think they would like to have nothing but GMO seeds available to buy to everyone, including home gardeners. And here is another article, from Reuters. Our History. Apparently, based on debate theory. 0000022336 00000 n But please own your words, since those original words I found objectional, and I respect you for what you say, and would feel foolish to participate in a conversation where at the end I am told I misquoted someone when I did not and would not, and if it happened by accident I would instantly correct and apologize, because I will own my mistake. [14][15], In 2021, Central Garden & Pet acquired Green Garden Products and its brand names Ferry-Morse, American Seed, Livingston Seed, McKenzie, NK Lawn & Garden, Jiffy, SUPERthrive, Dyna-Gro and Seeds of Change.[16]. 0000535474 00000 n Pupilla, if you didnt intend to discuss GMO, then I cannot understand why you would enter the conversation and object to a boycott of GMO seed companies. Now I see that two hours was not even enough to satisfy you and that you have more about what Ive had to say, to criticize and pick apart. You've made broad, generalizations about the people on both sides of this controversy as if you are not part of either side. 0000536209 00000 n And why would someone who likes gardening and natural living work for a company whose stated goals are completely against your values? More selfish motives that ignore what is good for mankind or the natural world, in general. You're right there are plenty of companies competing for worst company status. [4] Ferry changed the company name to Ferry, Church & Co, and two years later, when Church retired,[5] Ferry changed the name again, this time to D.M. 3. seedsNOW Your interpretation of another comment is again, not quite accurate. And for the sake of argument, lets say that Monsanto is not now selling GMO seed to home gardeners. The Citrus Browning is global, so if GMO is the only workable solution, not adopting it in Florida (after our Citrus growers sponsor it) will just mean other growing areas will pick up the slack, probably Brasil, and they likely will need to implement the GMO citrus and just take out produce just as Mexico did with strawberries and tomatoes already. Yet you dont consider this statement a label? [And now about you]. We grow our lawn without fertilizer and use clover and leave selective weeds in the lawn. Founded in 1850, Livingston is best known for bringing the modern tomato to the world. 0000033228 00000 n And even though we have different viewpoints, I've never used MG, nor do I plan to! I can hear that you are torn, but I am not having that problem at all. Again, you opened up the discussion of GMO when you challenged the idea of boycotting GMO seed companies. 0000510282 00000 n It then gets called a documentary. We are not well suited to discuss controversial subjects with each other. I have not appealed to you even to acknowledge that you told me millions of people are dying due to GMOs in India. All American Seeds are 100% Non-GMO. Most gardeners were quick to heap praise on their favorite seed companies and their . Free shipping any order of $50+! 0000002729 00000 n Yes, your original objection about the link that was inaccurate, was an early part of the topic being discussed. The big picture, this is just more of the False Dichotomy fallacy I discuss in my post which activists on both extremes seek to bully anyone chosing not to align themselves with the extremes. And to be honest, I think above all companies, they won't be lying about this! 0000016755 00000 n Hopefully if it is explained well enough others might get a better understanding of the issue.". And this is actually your version of limiting the scope of your discussion to only what was relative? Im worried about foods produced with GMO seeds that are not digestible and create immune reactions, and plants that do not feed insects and birds and animals. It also gives a list of seed companies that are not.(link)". I think that is the best way to influence others to try organic growing and get to the point where a company like Syngenta has no market. Sorry. That property is bordered by Second and Third Avenues on the east and west and by Burroughs and Amsterdam Avenues on the north and south, the city's northern limit at that time. I point people to natives and to the NEWFS to purchase natives. 0000003294 00000 n Our intention was to be the best source possible for gardeners wanting to grow tomatoes from seed. I don't see much else other than getting frustrated. If you have some opinion on GMO seeds, on Monsanto, or other companies producing GMO seeds, or the preservation of non GMO seeds, which are the topic of this thread, then perhaps you might share that in concise and direct language and leave out the rest. :) The depth of these posts is a nice contrast to the lengthy discussions elsewhere on the site regarding whether shiny brass hardware is currently "in" or "out." 0000017030 00000 n That's about it. But why artificially restrict my options like that. I don't think that that is a very reliable list. 1. Both a little assertive. :). Whose goal is to"Advance the ethical development and stewardship of the genetic resources of agricultural seed.". We take pride in helping families across the country enjoy gardening and the fresh foods and flowers the garden produces. People tend to gloss over all the grey, and even white, areas as a way to paint the entire issue as something to be reviled and hated, something to be fought against. How did you come to this conclusion? All Ferry-Morse seeds are 100% Non-GMO. They read any random thing, take it as gospel, and think they're informed without considering the source of the information, the bias of the author, or the fact that data can be manipulated to make any theory true. 'Any talk of avoiding the seeds for purchase is circular logic - intended to manipulate people by bullying the and using fear as a weapon'. I quote your response to them: "Yes, I understand that people exaggerate, often because they've had an emotional reaction to something that really disturbs them. California Poppy Ex Golden Flower Seeds (Seed Packet) .75-Gram. You want to make your own decision, I haven't reread the entire thread again, but I certainly have said nothing to attempt to take that choice away from you. They covered the seed company acquisitions briefly and had a graphic with the citation leading back to this person's research. Without pioneers in the field of biotechnology, we would still be battling diabetes with insulin taken from slaughterhouse animals. 0000011436 00000 n You answer in a round about way. That is disrespectful. In fact, I was agreeing with you, after you had already said that. Since a winter sowing forum is a place where people use seeds, I think the topic is entirely on point. Wouldn't it appear they are trying to have a monopoly on seeds? What a person intends and what they end up doing are not always the same. So, is that true or isnt it? To choose to evaluate each product on a case by case basis -- If I understand you to mean that if a product is GMO based, you will evaluate it at that point? But if you did not have an interest or the time to look at them, you only had to say so. If you are attempting to correct something that you believe is misleading about someone's post, than do so. I havent got the time to do an expose on Monsanto. I share my experiences about organic growing. I do not think Better Boy or the entire home garden seed market makes any difference to Monsanto. I'd really like to know. Is Ferry Morse owned by Monsanto? I dont even have the time to read the above entire article on Monsanto, but a quick scan of the section on Controversies, shows that all over the world, people are fighting against Monsanto because of the ill effect that their association with the company has had. Notice they do not even qualify it with the word "knowingly", they are giving you a guaranty, unlike the other companies. Add to Cart. We bought Giant, Violet Queen Zinna Seeds from Ferry-Morse Seed Co., then planted them, and carefully watered and nursed them! Two publications that came to mind are the Christian Science Monitor and Mother Earth News, a magazine that has been in business for 35 years. We just have different ways of looking at this and won't change each other. :-). Are they protecting us? Silly scare-mongering. All the people working tirelessly to be stewards of seeds and to create varieties of seed for home gardeners that are what we all want. Maryann, you mean the 'How to Source Truly High Quality Seeds' ? Because my clear meaning was to say I do not fit in those categories that others are trying to force upon me. Maybe it was her fault for misunderstanding something or maybe it was the fault of whatever she read, but the fact is that all the vague (or downright inaccurate), sensationalist, and/or fear mongering information regarding GMO's and Monsanto that is out there is not really helping anything. While most companies have a life span of 50-60 years, the average age of our brands is 122 years! And Im sure that can be useful and beneficial, but sometimes our best strength can become our biggest weakness. I vote with my pennies, just as you do with yours. There was no need to be offended, my addition of those key phrases might have indicated to you my intention to not offend you and that my mind was still open to further explanation. You see diseases developing, like the Citrus Greening disease, and you think, wellmaybe GMO and Monsanto will rescue us from these. ASM198 - Since the Infowars site is unreliable, I went looking for reliable sources and tried to think what I consider reliable. Over the years, dozens upon dozens of seed companies have come and gone. Conventional breeding methods that have become so efficient that the little guy doesn't have the resources to keep up is what concerns me most. The Associated Seed Growers, Inc. ("Asgrow") was formed in 1927 when seed competitors Everett B. Clark Seed Co., John H. Allen Seed Co., and N.B. Ferry-Morse invented the practice of selling seeds to home gardeners in individual illustrated packets, available to home gardeners by way of racks he created to showcase the seed varieties. Monsanto mounts an aggressive GMO PR campaign 2015, http://www.csmonitor.com/Business/The-Bite/2015/0318/Monsanto-mounts-an-aggressive-GMO-PR-campaign. RPT-Food giants pour millions into defeating Washington GMO label measure, http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/30/usa-politics-gmo-idUSL1N0IJ2G820131030. Is that your point of view? Which by the way, you don't actually know is true, unless some lab somewhere is doing random testing on the seed sold by Monsanto seed companies. So why would I want to continue this conversation? If you have done any research at all, you have to be aware of things that Monsanto has done and is doing, that you dont agree with. This is all I need to know.>>> OWNED BY MONSANTO OR SEMINIS OR SELL SMALL PERCENTAGES OF SEEDS FROM THEM. You pepper your posts saying *if this and that are true*, and then you expect me to clean up that mess by answering them all? I see you can 'quote' my post, but what is it about what I said that you object to? I only insist on using good references and doing a little fact checking. The idea started with a nylon stocking to hold the soil which, as it turns out, creates a well-aerated pot for healthy root growth. Again, I am worried that the consolidation will cause the loss of many varieties, and I think the original post calling for a boycott will only accelerate that since the home garden market is negligible. Pupilla - you seem to clearly be of a divided mind here. I purchase more seed from FEDCO, than Monsanto (Better Boy, Early Girl). Unfortunately the home garden market is only a drop in the bucket and if a big-ag company decided to discontinue it there would be varieties that could be lost forever. Is there any way to stop getting notifications of this topic? So you claim there is no reason to avoid any seed company. That being said, I will admit that GE crops are faaaaaaaar from impervious to these same kinds of disasters. And are you then saying that because the story about India was not completely accurate, that means that there is nothing to fear? :-), I hope that clarifies what I was trying to say. I'm not sure that was the point you mean to say. My original question Are you against any of the things Monsanto has done or is doing? you dont want to answer. There are smaller seed companies out there trying to get established just as the seed industry is consolidating. Language links are at the top of the page across from the title. Model# 9507. I have to stop here, I havent even been able to read the comments made after Pupillas. I expect the same good faith from you. Only if you are trying to convince them of something. [5][8] However, Wilson's health was poor, and in 1877 he sold the operation to Charles Copeland Morse and A. L. From 1856 onward, Ferry Morse seeds have been supplying the freshest and best garden seeds for the home gardens of American gardeners. I am not concerned about losing varieties of seeds as you are. No you dont see Monsanto rescuing us but yet, you are hoping that the GMO potential solution will. How about the film it links to, called Bitter Seeds which is a documentary about the impact of genetically modified cotton on Indias farmers and the suicide rate of over a quarter million Bt Cotton farmers each year due to financial stress resulting from massive crop failure and the price of Monsantos Bt seeds? What you have said here, is that people should not be avoiding Monsanto seed companies and you actually are indicating that you think that anyone who is avoiding Monsanto seed companies is either without logic, or has been manipulated or bullied and is afraid of something that they should not be afraid of. [5] The combined firm became the largest seed distribution company in the world. It is not a reliable reference as it was debunked by the peer-reviewed study in the Nature link. Ferry-Morse. I would like to see the world get away from this kind of development. [2] The recent development of the "Golden Rice Project" has aimed to genetically alter the staple crop to provide vitamin A to people who depend on rice for sustenance and as a result of their diet, often suffer severe deficiencies in the nutrient which can cause blindness and increases infant mortality rates in the developing world.In fact, as the worlds population continues to grow, use of GE crops shows significant promise to stabilizing the worlds food supply.